Bow guys what's your range??

[dewey]

So I stayed away from the bows because all I hear about is the lowend. I kite at Sherman most of the time and am not really looking for killer low end. What's the comfortable high end of a bow kite? I found this on the airush forum.

HALO in strong winds
date 2/15/2006 8:48:54 AM
message For most of the riders out there.
The reason I am posting this e-mail is to let you know about the Halo. We all know that the BOW kites are excelent in gusty winds compare to other C kites and also very good in strong winds, but please understand this: In Strong winds a lot of things can happen. I would not recomand going out in 40 mph winds. This is when people get hurt. Also in strong winds you get a lot of gusty winds the more gusty it is, the more dangerous it is for the kites even the HALO.
3 days ago I saw some one out of controle with a CROSBOW kite. The wind pick up and he was on a 12. The kite was so unstable that sundenly it reversed on its self and start draging the rider. Thank God he was far out because once he got near of the beach the kite crashed. CROSSBOW or HALO still we need to be carefull in strong winds. My suggestion is when the wind pick up to high 30's to 40's use your own judgement. Me personaly I won't kite in winds higher then 38 mph unless their is a competition or unless I have to do it.
That guy was in shock after we all ran to help him.
They were 2 other kiters out there that day and both of them were on C kites. One of them stay out but the other one pull the realease system. I found out that the other guy was 225 lbs. These are the days when you wish you were heavy.
Any way I just wanted to let you know that even if everybody says that BOW kites are very good in strong wind, be advice, a lot of thing can happen in these strong winds.
from Dimitri Maramenides ()

So other than killer low end and good gusty control, why did you choose a bow style kite?

[andyandmarlys]

Bow kites offer so much control that people sometimes feel empowered to do stupid things.... Could I ride a 12m bow in 40mph? YES Is that a good idea? NO

These kites can depower so much that it can give you a false sense of security.. In 40mph if everything works, the kite will give minimal power and you will be able to ride. If things go bad, you still have to remember that you are connected to 12m of fabric that will do whatever it needs to do. I don't know many people who could hold a 12m in 40mph on a C kite. Most people could probably hold a bow kite in 40mph... but when a line breaks, or you lose control, you have to realize that you are connected to a huge piece of fabric.

I think that for most people, a 12m bow kite will cover most conditions... say 10-30mph... you could hold on to the kite in higher winds, but then you are eliminating your safety net.

Last year durring a downwinder, I had my 14m Rhino in 30mph... This was the upper limit of what was reasonable on this kite, but it was managable... Had I been given the choice, I would have taken a 10 or 7m kite...

This year, I can say that a 12m bow really has the low end of a 16m+, but the upper end of a 9m. On the lower end this is advantageous... have a kite that powers like a 16+ with the turning speed of a 12m.... On the upper end, this becomes less advantageous... Powers like a 9m, but still turns like a 12m.

This is why this year I am modifying my quiver to an overall smaller size...

My biggest kite last year was a 19.5... this year it will be a 14...

Las year my smallest kite was a 7m... this year it will be a 6m.

The real advantage of these kites is in the low end because it you are able to ride a 12m when everyone else is on a 16-18m... and your kite will still turn like a 12m.... On the upper end, if you are riding a 12m when everyone else is riding on 8-9m... you will still be able to ride, but your kite will turn like a 12m while everyone else has kites that turn like a 8-9m...

In my best estimation, you can multiply a bow kite by 1.4 to get the equivelent low end... So a 12m has a low end like a 16.8 C kite.... I know that Ken Winner recently stated in an interview that a 12m C kite will have as much low end as a 12m Bow kite... but I think he is smoking crack when he stated this... or maybe he just doesn't know... A bow kite has much more low end than an equivelent C kite... Perhaps he will change his tune next year when North makes a bow kite...

The depower of C kites for 2006 has increased incredibly... The Vegas 06 has superb depower... but I am not convinced that it has the low end of a bow kite.

From my perspective, this is the hot lineup for this year.

Beginners - A moderate bow kite like the switchblade.... more forgiving and easier to fly than both C and Bow kites

Intermediate - Advanced - A full on bow kite with moderate (not high, not low) bar pressure.. (turbo diesel or modified crossbow)

Pro- I have no idea... The pro's seem to be stuck on C kites, but I doubt this will last... Consider that current pro's have spend years and years training on C-kites... are they going to change immediately? Some pro's are taking to the bow kites, but not most.. Is this because they don't need the depower, or hate bridles, or don't want to readjust their jumps? I don't know... I predict though that next year we see most pro's on bows... (you gotta remember that Bow technology is really only 6 months old)

Also..my perspective is that winds over 30mph are VERY STRONG.... Winds over 30mph consist for less than 3% of Bay Area kiteboarding... and ALWAYS fad to less winds within hours. I can't really think of a great session I have had over 30mph... Most of my great sessions are in winds of 25mph or less.

Hope this helps...

ANDY

[charlie]

dewey
the bows technology has been around for one and ahalf years or more
i flew a bow all last year!(my 12 rapture)
andy, dont sperd miss information,maybe you only knew about them for 6 months
as for why...
turn n speed
range
depower
board speed
safty
as for the top end you can control more wind .but..
i would not take a 12m into anything over 25,at that point i would rig a 9m or 6m rapture2
my range on my 12mrapture last year, i could ride upwind when the 14m kite were out and stay out when the 10m were comeing off the beach!
also once i was out in the tules on my 12m rapture it blew like stink
only big dave was out on his 16m rrd zh,

[andyandmarlys]

Charlie,

if we are calling rapture 1`s bows, then we need to give credit to cabrinha`s contra which was the first company to offer a more open kite in 2004. (pro span) Bows and supported leading edges (SLE) ... ie... bridled inflatables were not readily available until august.

Also to agree with you, I'd much rather be on a 8m bow in 25mph than a 12m.... but if I didn't have an 8m, I'd still ride my 12 in 25....or even 30.... but I weigh a lot too.

[charlie]

andy
I am calling my rapture1 a bow,as for your contra iam not sure let me chew on that
right now i cant think of you, with out your BoW, be it in 12mph or 22mph!

ok i chewed on it and ya flater ack and reduced tips = bow kite
contra might have been frist, what 2 years ago?

[dewey]

So they are great for awsome low end, a bit higher topend, and total depower. Do you think that they will start to turn like modern C kites in the next few generations? I'm sure that the 07's will solve the inverson problems, but wihout extra pullys would be nice. Although I'm sure they will be the future I still don't see what the major advantage is right now in smooth steady consistant winds.

PS I'm not a bow hater by any means. I'm blown away with what Andy could do in light winds. I am just thinking that maybe next year I'll be picking up a 10m bow to add to the quiver, and am asking myself what I would gain.

[Sander]

For low end don't forget the most important variable: board size

[andyandmarlys]

bottom line for me is that I will use smaller quicker kites across the board... given 20mph, I wil ride a 10m bow instead of a 14m c kite.... all the lowend of a 14... turning speed of a 10....

also, relaunch, self launch, and self landing are stupidly easy with a bow

[Pablito]

I'm still visualizing Ken Winner smoking crack. Hmmm.

[marin]

I rode WW raptures and Rage II's last year. Maybe they were not "bows", but I think they had many of the same characteristics (huge range, 4 lines, almost total depower). For me at 45 years old, bad knees and trying to be as safe as possible in a not so safe sport, the bow kite concept is great. I will be checking out the new bow's this year and look forward to trying out the different options. I will also probably try some of the C kites with big range and complete depower through bar movements.

Evan at Live2kite.com will be getting many of the bow brands for demo over the next couple of weeks and I look forward to trying them. I am especially interested in trying the Waroo and the Caution Answer. The Waroo is sold at a great price and has gotten some very good reviews. The claim is they have more of a C kite feeling.

I think it is great to have options and very different types of kites for different types and levels of riders.


:)