Vanguard - Where to demo and sizes

[kitet]

Hi everyone - I'm thinking of buying a Firewire Vanguard but would like to demo the board first and get some advice regarding size. I'm 5'11", 150lb, ride strapless, mostly at Waddell when riding directional. From what I read, people are riding really small boards when it comes to the Vanguard. What's your recommendation for size? And do you know where to demo one in the Bay Area (3rd, Waddell, Crissy...)?

Thank you!

[mbzporvida]

I'm at Waddell most weekends and will let you demo my 5'1" Firewire Vader.

I'm 195 lbs. and it works great for me.

Send me your info. in a PM

[J-GAR]

Hi kitet.

mbzporvida is right, a 5'1" Vader would be good place to start for a demo. Most people are going with the Vader lately over the Vanguard. Vader is better in chop and waves and rides more dynamic.

For a Vanguard, I would recommend you try the 5'2 if you are set on one of those as a starting point.

From there you can decide if you want to go a size smaller.

Try the Vader though and I'm sure you will have a big smile on your face :)

Either mbzporvida or myself can get you a demo of a Vader 5'1" at Waddell or possibly Sherman.

I am a local authorized dealer for Firewire who does demos, and have a new 5'1" Vader in stock if you are interested in buying one.

Thanks,
John

[Frappes]

I am 5'10" 160lbs and I ride a 5'0" Vanguard and it is perfect. I've also ridden the 4'10" Vader and it was very fun (although I didn't get a chance to ride it in waves).

I found the Vanguard to have better lightwind capabilities (I can get going in 14knts on my 8m) and it feels easier to do airs. The Vader feels a bit more playful, snapping quick turns.

Vader didn't feel different enough for me to want to trade in my Vanguard, but if I were buying now, I'd probably go with the 4'10" Vader purely for the fact that it can fit in a golf bag for travel.

[Yoda]

I'm 5'11", 150lb, ride strapless, mostly at Waddell when riding directional. From what I read, people are riding really small boards when it comes to the Vanguard. What's your recommendation for size? And do you know where to demo one in the Bay Area (3rd, Waddell, Crissy...)?

Thank you!

I thought I'd chime in. Like you I'm also 5'11 and 150lbs.
I've been riding the Vanguard 5'0 for 2+ years, so I know this board VERY well (better than most). I've also spent some considerable time on the Vader 5'1 (felt too big, but was more stable).
The Vanguard 5'2 and the Vader 5'1 are both the same volume at 22.9ltrs. At your weight, you (and I) could pretty much paddle surf these, which makes them really too big (for us) for kitesurfing imo.
These boards need to be sized down a lot (more so for kitesurfing) and they really should NOT be sized by their lengths, but rather by their volume. I'm going to disagree with J-Gar's recommendation on this. At your weight (height is irrelevant), you should be looking at the Vanguard 5'0 (20ltr) or the Vader 4'10 (19ltr). The Vader is better for the waves due to it's increased rocker and narrower tail, so if the coast is your destined spot, I'd focus on that model instead. You may like the Vader 5'1, but there are 175lb+ guys loving the 4'10, so bare that in mind. I'm looking to get the 4'10 as well.
There are only two dealers locally (Edit: only one demo's). If you're lucky, the Firewire kite rep may tour around again this summer and you may try catching up with him.

If you go the route I did and buy one without demo'ing first, GO SMALL!!! You will not regret it!!! The only regret I've seen is from all of those that bought it too big.
If you do buy one without demo'ing first, it's good to understand the importance of your weight in relation to the volume sizing with these modern shaped boards, so please read this article:
http://surfsimply.com/surf-coaching/vol ... ht-ratios/

My formula for narrowing down the sizing for the Tomo kite surfboards is this:
Use Firewire's calculator to find your ideal volume size for paddle surfing:
http://www.firewiresurfboards.com/volum ... -selector/
Fill it out like this:
Level = Advanced
Fitness = Excellent
Age = For 35 and over, put in 30
Weight = xyz
Body Type = xyz
Click on Better Waves
Then size down 1-3 liters from the smallest recommended size. Since the kite versions only come in 2" increments you may be in between volumes. If so, go for the smaller size.
Edit: After playing around with the FW calculator and comparing what others are reporting for board size and body weight, I think 1-3 liters is more accurate.

I'm usually at Sherman, so hit me up if you want to demo my board. If you're out there, look for the guy on a Tomo with the red WMFG traction pad. I'm a local ambassador for WMFG. WMFG makes a traction pad specifically for the Tomo boards. OT: They also make awesome pumps if you'd like to demo mine.
http://wmfg.co

[Frappes]

It's also worth mentioning that as of 2 weeks ago, FW is planning on shipping the kite construction of the Evo in June/July. (http://firewiresurfboards.com/f/forum/k ... #post57003)

It looks like a rad board that you can supposedly size down even more (Tomo riding a 5'1": https://vimeo.com/101923181).

[J-GAR]

Kitet, the 5'1 Vader is a good place to start. Instead of getting into an internet agreeing/disagreeing match since everyone has different opinions (you know what they say about opinions :) ), a demo will let you know if it is too big or not. I was recommending the 5'1 since you are a little taller (height does have some impact, think of a 7 foot tall dude on a 4 foot board, versus a 4 foot tall dude on same board (both of same weight), just to show an extreme example) and not knowing your experience. I ride a 5'1" Vader and it is perfect for me and I have a many years of strapless wave experience at Waddell and been riding the Vanguard and Vader since they first came out. I am a 5'10 and 178 lbs. You can demo my 5'1" board to get a feeling for its size. If you are experienced riding strapless, you could get away with the 4'10" Vader at your weight. A demo will tell you between the two which size is best. Also, with bigger waves it is better to have a little bigger board. If you are just going to ride flat water Sherman style, smaller board could work well. Either way, I can help get you a board in the size you want to try and/or buy. I may be at Waddell tomorrow. And to disagree with Yoda, yes there are local dealers that offer demos, I am one of them :) and if I don't have the size you need to demo, I can work with Firewire rep who lives near Santa Cruz to get you the size.

And I will not try to sell you other things like pumps and traction pads since you were only asking about Firewire boards :)

Thanks,
John

[Yoda]

And to disagree with Yoda, yes there are local dealers that offer demos, I am one of them :) and if I don't have the size you need to demo, I can work with Firewire rep who lives near Santa Cruz to get you the size.

And I will not try to sell you other things like pumps and traction pads since you were only asking about Firewire boards :)

Thanks,
John

Nice! I'm glad someone has made the effort to have demo boards available.
For the record, I don't sell WMFG, just promote it. If you want grip for your Tomo board, it's a nice option since it's the first and only grip shaped to fit these specific boards.

[J-GAR]

Cool, would like to see and try out the WMFG pad.

[Batshitcrazy]

Everyone is riding too short a board these days.

My rule of thumb: if your kiteboard is not at least 1.9x your height you are in grave danger.

Archimedes Principle: If your kiteboard cannot comfortably accommodate you and your three closest friends, one of you is going to get eaten by a shark.

Murphy's Law: Onboard a kite board, you should always carry enough food for two weeks survival and (3) fresh water stills. It takes a long time to get to Hawaii.

Coast Guard Regulations: A kite powered vessel should not leave the dock without (3) beers per crew member readily accessible.

For these and other reasons, I strongly recommend the vanguard 15 (pictured below).

For additional information, please contact the vanguard-15 class president:
clintonearlhayes@gmail.com
http://www.v15.org/