Twin Tip Board ban comming to Crissy

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Re: Twin Tip Board ban comming to Crissy

Postby Thor29 » Wed Jul 09, 2014 10:12 am

Tony Soprano wrote:
Thor29 wrote:What really bugs me is that all you guys are worried about losing Crissy as a kiteboarding spot and in the meantime the upper launch at 3rd Ave is eroding away and will disappear in a couple of years. Nobody, including the SFBA, seems to care.



You have thread jacked my discussion, please remove your post and resurrect this thread.

viewtopic.php?f=1&t=12270&p=85933&hilit=3rd+erosion#p85933

You will see the SFBA position on this subject.


Okay, you're right. Sorry for the hijack.

But really, this thread is just a troll anyway with the suggested ban on twin tips. What are the "real" solutions? As I see it, there aren't any. Newbie kiters, out of towners, and people with no sense, will continue to do dumb things. You can try to self-police the area, but as seen in discussions of bad behavior at Alameda, people don't listen. So all that's left is to convince a government entity to create beach cops (thugs) who can use the threat of violence to stop people from misbehaving. Then when you try to pump up too big of a kite, or show up with a Go-Joe, a beach cop can beat the crap out of you "for your own safety".

If the Coast Guard ever gets tired of picking up downed kiters, they can institute a fine and put up a big sign on the beach that says that if you have to get rescued, you have to pay the fine. Of course, some cheapskate will refuse to get picked up and drown.

So here's the "answer" - keep trying to educate people both here on the forum and out on the beach and then just have some fun while you can and stop worrying so much.
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Re: Twin Tip Board ban comming to Crissy

Postby le noun » Wed Jul 09, 2014 9:16 pm

Why not do the "bracelet tag" and iko certification card like it is in place in some other tough spots in the US?
With so many regulars at Crissy, I don't think it would be too hard to put together?
I've kited that spot a few times and going under the golden gate into the open ocean is probably one of the most magical thing ever, EVERY SINGLE TIME.

I think it's been mentioned before, but the threat apparently doesn't come from people reading this forum. So posting mean things about TTs to get attention here is not gonna solve much...

How about giants signs on the concrete wall and on the grass where we rig that would say simple things like: "FIRST TIME KITERS: READ THE CRISSY GUIDE LINE AT THE SHOWERS."
Followed by a list of items REQUIRED such as radio, helmet, knife, flash light, kite buddy, a board with a lot of volume or at least a life vest if riding a TT, etc...

Self policy by the regulars (via wristbands and kite tags) or a better signage are the only options I can think off.
I think anybody who's been riding at Crissy can't thank you enough for all the work you're putting into this Jeff.
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Re: Twin Tip Board ban comming to Crissy

Postby sanjose_kiter » Wed Jul 09, 2014 9:20 pm

So, on the same subject, do I qualify to ride at Crissy field with my TT ??? I am also proficient with strapped surf board but have no desire to ride surf board.
- 3rd season kiter
- ride regularly at 3rd Ave, Alameda, Sherman, and occasionally Waddell when the surf is 6 feet or less.
- have a low wind, floaty TT , RRD 10 knots board

TIA
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Re: Twin Tip Board ban comming to Crissy

Postby reyrivera » Wed Jul 09, 2014 10:25 pm

I'm not sure you want to involved IKO certification for regular riders here. Those cards are unreliable, and can be easily picked up from shops. I've met a lot of IKO level 3 visitor riders and they are dangerous as hell in water.

le noun wrote:Why not do the "bracelet tag" and iko certification card like it is in place in some other tough spots in the US?
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Re: Twin Tip Board ban comming to Crissy

Postby le noun » Thu Jul 10, 2014 7:29 am

reyrivera wrote:I'm not sure you want to involved IKO certification for regular riders here. Those cards are unreliable, and can be easily picked up from shops. I've met a lot of IKO level 3 visitor riders and they are dangerous as hell in water.

le noun wrote:Why not do the "bracelet tag" and iko certification card like it is in place in some other tough spots in the US?

I was just making a reference to I think Montrose, where they ask for iko card so they can put a tag on your kite, I don't think it's about having a card, it's about telling new people there that they are REQUIRED to have a card and a tag, therefore they have to ask somebody in charge at the beach to give them a card and the famous tag. This gives the opportunity for whoever is in charge to A) talk to people about the safety protocols and dangers of the spot, and B) easily spot somebody new to the spot (on and off the water) if they don't have a tag on their kite.
No tag and getting rescued? $200 fine.

I also really like the idea of paying a "little" $10 or $20 fee for each rescue of people who have a tag.
Save all that money and give it to the coast guards at the end of the year.
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Re: Twin Tip Board ban comming to Crissy

Postby Tony Soprano » Thu Jul 10, 2014 8:20 am

I complement all for no real flaming on this discussion.

I am a liaison contact for the SFBA at Crissy Field.

The SFBA president is in continuing consultation with the Golden Gate National Recreation Area, and the Coast Guard. This is good when something comes up, they have someone to call.

In the past we got some unwanted publicity with 9 people in trouble outside the Golden Gate Bridge ebbing out towards the Farrallon islands. It was a North West wind direction and ebbing, so the wind was partly shaded at the north tower area and caught many off guard.
Well it made the news and a CHP helicopter was involved plus three Coast Guard Cutters.
Making the situation worse was a windsurfer who was not wearing a wet suit. This was a SEARCH and rescue. Not all were accounted for. There was a windsurfer intervention with the guy who does not like to wear a wet suit afterwords.

It is Saturday Night and the Coast Guard Command Staff called the SFBA president at 10:00 pm wanting to know what the heck we are doing out there. Then he called me. So we do have a good line of communication.

The Coast Guard Captain of the port issued a letter last April over concerns of increased rescues, bad behavior in interaction with commercial vessels and decision making.

We are currently in good standing with the GGNRA park service as we provide in there words "color" to the beach.


If we can not keep things cool on the beach and water, there could be something worse ahead for us.

As an example the GGNRA is going through a lengthy process to ban DOGs on the east beach at Crissy field and other areas of the GGNRA because of bad behavior.

Our user group is far smaller than the Dog user group. For us it would be easier to ban kite boarding than the Dog people.

It is so hard to judge a persons common sense and skill level. But at least all should be given a comprehensive briefing of the current conditions and unseen hazards of kite boarding at Crissy field.

The SFBA is in discussion with the GGNRA for more signage closer to the beach.
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Re: Twin Tip Board ban comming to Crissy

Postby moblvet » Fri Jul 11, 2014 12:23 pm

"As an example the GGNRA is going through a lengthy process to ban DOGs on the east beach at Crissy field and other areas of the GGNRA because of bad behavior."

I was the veterinarian for the City of San Francisco's Animal and Welfare Commission back in the day. The directive to ban/limit canines in the GGNRA, came from Washington DC as a policy for all federal park lands. This was not initiated locally, not for bad behavior, just that someone in Washington, didn't want dogs on federal lands as a policy.

So Jeff, kudos for the good you do at Crissy, but you still always bring your negative connotation of canines to your threads.
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Re: Twin Tip Board ban comming to Crissy

Postby Tony Soprano » Fri Jul 11, 2014 2:09 pm

Please become a SFBA member if you are not already.

thank you
Last edited by Tony Soprano on Fri Jul 11, 2014 8:10 pm, edited 3 times in total.
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Re: Twin Tip Board ban comming to Crissy

Postby recoprianto » Fri Jul 11, 2014 2:14 pm

Banning Twintips at a spot is about as arbitrary as trying to regulate how thick of a wetsuit you must wear or any other asinine argument you can come up with. I take offense to someone stating that most of the rescues are from any identifiable user group other than beginners or newbies. Where is the hard data supporting the statistics being referenced? The truth, there isn't any...it is all just made up over-exaggerated bullshit used to attempt to support someone's selfish viewpoint.

It doesn't matter what kind of board you ride, what brand of kite you fly, or even how thick your wetsuit is. You are either an aware, competent kiter that can get themselves out of most situations, or you aren't.

A campaign, by the locals, on all of the forums, spot locator websites, etc... to scare folks away that shouldn't be riding spots is the only way to deter people from riding certain spots. What makes you think IKO or some other faceless industry organization is qualified to regulate Crissy? Does their certificate magically make you a competent kiter with good judgement? I have traveled all of the world and have seen many IKO certified instructors and riders that have no business riding at Crissy...

Police and manage your own spot. If you ask someone else to do so, you open up the chance that the someone else may just regulate you out of using the spot.
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Re: Twin Tip Board ban comming to Crissy

Postby Tony Soprano » Fri Jul 11, 2014 2:30 pm

recoprianto wrote:Banning Twintips at a spot is about as arbitrary as trying to regulate how thick of a wetsuit you must wear or any other asinine argument you can come up with. I take offense to someone stating that most of the rescues are from any identifiable user group other than beginners or newbies. Where is the hard data supporting the statistics being referenced? The truth, there isn't any...it is all just made up over-exaggerated bullshit used to attempt to support someone's selfish viewpoint.

It doesn't matter what kind of board you ride, what brand of kite you fly, or even how thick your wetsuit is. You are either an aware, competent kiter that can get themselves out of most situations, or you aren't.

A campaign, by the locals, on all of the forums, spot locator websites, etc... to scare folks away that shouldn't be riding spots is the only way to deter people from riding certain spots. What makes you think IKO or some other faceless industry organization is qualified to regulate Crissy? Does their certificate magically make you a competent kiter with good judgement? I have traveled all of the world and have seen many IKO certified instructors and riders that have no business riding at Crissy...

Police and manage your own spot. If you ask someone else to do so, you open up the chance that the someone else may just regulate you out of using the spot.



I Disagree with your first paragraph. I think wetsuit thickness needs to be affirmed for a place like Crissy, also, I know why each rescue happened and why. Mainly unfamiliarity to the site. General lack of skills and common sense. And that they tried to sail with a twin tip as opposed to a surfboard, raceboard, or foil.
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